thegirlsclub

[Dorothea]

Before learning to walk, one have to learn how to crawl. Same goes for fighting (and everything else, pretty much). I am trying, mostly for my own enjoyment, to categorize the different levels, or stages of heavy fighting.

I think one can go to any depth of detail here and I find the subject fascinating. Here are some example of what I am talking about:
- To learn how to throw a successful combination, you need to master the return of your weapon.
- Before throwing a raising flat-snap, you need to know how to throw a ordinary "1A" one.
- Before generating power whit your goofy-foot forward, you need to be able to generate power from your natural stance.

Do you have any more of these?

It would be interesting (as a purely theoretical exercise) to try to define different stages in fighting ability, much like the belting systems in martial arts. "In order to get a yellow belt, you need to show that you master X,Y,Z). Any thoughts on this? What would be part of these different stages if they existed?
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Dorothea Weberin, KSCA
Dun in Mara, Insulae Draconis, Drachenwald

[Ariadne]

Before doing "X" in the excitement of sparring or a bout, you should be able to do it reliably in a drill or against the pell.

[Dorothea]

We did a ("highly scientific" ) experiment the other day. First we discussed the basic shots and tried to "rank" them from the easiest to hardest to execute. Then we had a guy who never held a rattan stick before try them out on the pell and tell us which one was harder/easier to execute with power and correct technique (as correct he could manage to pull it off).

Here are the results (tadaaa!) of our efforts - from easiest to hardest:

1) Onside, body
2) Onside, leg
3) Onside head
4) Straight body
5) Offside head
6) Straight head
7) Wrap body
Wrap leg
9) Wrap head
10) Offside body
11) Offside leg

There is a caveat: Once the technique for the wraps were learned somewhat (the guy is a fast learner) the wraps were perceived as easier than the offside shot. However, before he learned the wrap technique, wraps were further down the list. Also, it was interesting to note that the straight in shots were not at the top of the list. But we figured this is due to the precision ('targeting') needed in those shots.

So the theory then that when you train a beginner one should start from the top of the list, and not start introducing the next shot until the previous one was learned.

Comments?
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Dorothea Weberin, KSCA
Dun in Mara, Insulae Draconis, Drachenwald

[audax]

Starting with the basics is a radical notion.
_________________
Martel le Hardi
squire to Meser Lyonel Oliver Grace, fostered to Sir Gaston de Clermont
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The Minstrel's Champion

[Marithim]

That's what I assumed as a newbie myself. I was forbidden to do wraps until... well, recently, because the idea is to have a perfect dependable flat snap to start before you do a wrap.

But it does remind me of something my teacher told me the other day. To everyone comes a slightly different response. He's met beginners who throw perfect wraps, but when it comes to flat snaps, they can't do it. Same with the other way around. So what one person deigns easier may not be the easiest shot for the next person. And that would change your list somewhat. I don't think I've been doing straight shots (like straight down or diagonal down or stabbing?) yet at all.

[audax]

Every building looks different but they all have foundations. Every good foundation has similar characteristics.

Easy has got nothing to do with it.
_________________
Martel le Hardi
squire to Meser Lyonel Oliver Grace, fostered to Sir Gaston de Clermont
-------------------------------------------------------

The Minstrel's Champion

[Dorothea]

Of course everyone is different, learn differently and should start from the basics. That doesn't mean one shouldn't analyze the ways of training and in what order to practise certain things.

In our case, we aim to categorize items as far as it goes (due to above individual differences, there is an obvious limit) in order to make it easier to learn. Because I do think some techniques are easier than others. Not only easier to learn, but also easier to execute. Or perhaps I should use the word "natural" as in: some things are more natural to execute. And in my experience, these are not all that different between people.
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Dorothea Weberin, KSCA
Dun in Mara, Insulae Draconis, Drachenwald

[Arngrim]

Interesting experiment,and a good sound foundation for building a training system. I'm working on one myself, and I like the way you think.

The usual reason for not teaching wraps in the beginning is that they can, if thrown improperly damage your elbow. I like the way Gaston throws them, it alignes all the joints prior to impact naturally. The worst way I know of is in any way forcing the turnover or scooping the wrap. Both of these tend to happen more often when the shot is rushed, as it often is in a tournament environment.
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Male. Fighter since 1995.
Location: Sweden/Nordmark, Drachenwald